1. Turk Turon Turk Turon United States says:

    1) These research papers used high-risk populations with extensive histories of drug-abuse, alcohol abuse, domestic violence and criminal records. The research has little to offer about the risks of keeping a firearm in a "normal" American home.

    2) Correlation does not prove causation. This is like doing a study to determine how diabetics differ from non-diabetics, noting that diabetics are more likely to possess insulin, and concluding that insulin possession is a risk factor for diabetes.

    3) American suicide rates actually compare favorably with other nations where firearm ownership is lower. People bent on self-destruction will find ways to do it even if firearms are not available.

    4) A majority of American homicide victims (up to 80% in some surveys) had criminal records, or had traces of narcotics in their systems when they arrived at the ER. Most homicide in the U.S. is criminals killing other criminals.

    • Andrew Grant Andrew Grant United States says:

      1) These research papers used high-risk populations with extensive histories of drug-abuse, alcohol abuse, domestic violence and criminal records. The research has little to offer about the risks of keeping a firearm in a "normal" American home.

      What is normal to you is abnormal to others. Do you somehow believe that you have a status that is above that of others? What difference does the population make...which, I might add, you are exaggerating about anyways.

      2) Correlation does not prove causation. This is like doing a study to determine how diabetics differ from non-diabetics, noting that diabetics are more likely to possess insulin, and concluding that insulin possession is a risk factor for diabetes.

      All studies that show the dangers of cigarette smoking are correlational in nature. Enough correlations can, in sum, show causation. And with gun violence, the correlations are all there. More guns correlates positively with more gun violence. It is just a statistical fact at this point. That points to the obvious solution (reduce the amount of guns in our society) but this is obvious so you think it is wrong.

      3) American suicide rates actually compare favorably with other nations where firearm ownership is lower. People bent on self-destruction will find ways to do it even if firearms are not available.

      Indeed, very depressed and repressed societies like Korea and Japan, who have lower gun ownership, have higher suicide rates. But, they have extremely low rates of gun violence, which is what we are talking about reducing here. Besides, we would have even lower rates of suicide if we did not have such an effective tool at our disposal to do the job. Many more suicides would fail, and those people would still be around for us to help.

      4) A majority of American homicide victims (up to 80% in some surveys) had criminal records, or had traces of narcotics in their systems when they arrived at the ER. Most homicide in the U.S. is criminals killing other criminals.

      On this point, you are just wrong. Most gun violence is committed domestically by the family members on each other or themselves with the gun they personally own. Crime (robbery and burglary) accounts for a lot of gun deaths too. Ironically, self-defense, the reason gun advocates say they own guns, accounts for about 1% of all gun deaths.

      That 1% accounts for less people than the amount of people that could be saved by reducing the amount of guns we have in this country.

      • Stephen Garramone Stephen Garramone United States says:

        Exactly.  The guns bring violence onto the owners and little onto the "perps."  And stupid home gun accidents ... Oh My God!

        Keep the guns in an armory, where their use and storage would be supervised.

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